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Post by Spellbound454 on Sept 21, 2011 16:24:18 GMT -5
Video footage showing two eight-year-old boys fighting at a Lancashire Labour club has been condemned by the British Medical Association (BMA).
The film, shot at Greenlands Labour Club in Preston, shows the boys wrestling with each other on the floor in front of an audience of adults.
Club manager Michelle Anderson said they worked closely with police and the boys "loved it" and were not in danger.
The boys taking part are seen trying to pin each other down.
The father of one of them, Nick Hartley, said his son was not at risk of harm.
He said: "He loves the sport. It's not one bit dangerous, it's a controlled sport. He likes to do it, he's never forced to do it, he wants to do it, so leave him to do it." www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lancashire-14998593.......................................................................................................... What planet are these people on?......this is outrageous. What do you think? |
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Post by jonbel on Sept 22, 2011 11:18:55 GMT -5
I think Child Protection should get involved. I don't believe an eight year old would choose to do this, those boys are trying to please their fathers.
It's ironic that competitive sports in schools have been stopped, in favour of dumbing down any harmless sporting achievements, and yet cage-fighting without rules has slipped under the radar. Is gambling involved?
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Post by pod 7 on Sept 22, 2011 13:00:58 GMT -5
When i saw it on the news this morning , i had a feeling that something was not right but couldn't put my finger on it, then i saw the girl in a bikini (horrors i thought ) the story unfolded, i knew nothing of what was going on ,
Its held in a pub WHY?? All those men there WHY?? not there kids- so the conclusion i drew was
Whats wrong with a sports cent-
All the blokes (betting wouldn't surprise me) defo getting drunk
Didn't like the cage--until it was explained--the kids are off the floor and it stops them falling on the floor
As for the kids wrestling each other, kids do that anyway--the spin off to that is self protection especially this day and age with the stabbings that go on in the streets
So i didn't mind the wrestling---but the venue was totally wrong--along with girl in the bikini--Never thought i would ever say the girl in the bikini was out-of order, but you know what i mean
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Post by Spellbound454 on Sept 22, 2011 13:02:48 GMT -5
I don't know what the parents can be thinking.....What if these little darlings start off in the playground plus they are gaining a kudos which shouldn't be theirs at that age.
Teenage years are difficult enough without being a thug.
I saw the stupid father vicariously living through this child.
Should have just got a pit bull like everyone else with that mentality and left the children out of it.
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Post by starlight07 on Sept 22, 2011 13:05:20 GMT -5
I'm surprised what the club manager has said.
I wouldn't like boys fighting one another and that it being a sport for people to feast upon. I think parents or father are forcing their children to do this...
Agreed that the schools have turned down competitive sports and I would prefer Martial Arts being taught instead.
Reminds me of Gladiators.
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Post by starlight07 on Sept 22, 2011 13:42:27 GMT -5
Wrestling is alright but the venue and the bikini girl were wrong. I don't quite get the logic. Wrestling as a sport or an entertainment and that too of vulnerable children whilst adults are watching it is bad. Kids don't wrestle one another - not unless it's a fight or a play up thing. It's a combat sport...it's dangerous and it shouldn't be encouraged.
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Post by isa on Sept 23, 2011 15:40:47 GMT -5
The martial pursuit itself is fine. The competitions are fine, providing they are professionally regulated. The only thing I’d question is the cultural context. Looking at the location, and the behaviour of the clientele, I found myself sharing the reporter’s concerns over how appropriate an environment it is for a child - ie. subjecting them to an atmosphere thick with adult lust for violence. They just need to tone the audience down a bit.
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Post by starlight07 on Sept 23, 2011 16:21:02 GMT -5
The martial pursuit itself is fine. The competitions are fine, providing they are professionally regulated. The only thing I’d question is the cultural context. Looking at the location, and the behaviour of the clientele, I found myself sharing the reporter’s concerns over how appropriate an environment it is for a child - ie. subjecting them to an atmosphere thick with adult lust for violence. They just need to tone the audience down a bit. Cage fighting and young children? How can it be not dangerous or risk free when professionals can get injured sometimes? It's not actually a sport but a show for adults here...I bet they must have gambled too. It's not even done for self-discipline purposes... Though I used the word gladiators, maybe that was a bit far-fetched but I've heard of adults even using animals for such type of amusement and they think it's sports. |
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Post by isa on Sept 23, 2011 17:00:44 GMT -5
That the bouts take place in a cage is hardly relevant. The cage is a sensationalist detail intended to give the sport greater commercial gravity.
I never said it wasn’t dangerous or risk free so I’m not sure why you are asking me this. Since you mention it though - it’s nothing like professional cage fighting; the kids don’t strike each other for a start. The term is ‘mixed martial art’, which is typically an amalgamation of various martial disciplines; in practice it’s scarcely different from learning something like Jujitsu, the main point of difference and concern being the aforementioned cultural context.
I’m sure deep down you understand that it is possible for something to be a sport and a show for adults.
What isn’t?… and how could you possibly know this?
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Post by starlight07 on Sept 24, 2011 7:43:15 GMT -5
Being a hardcore wrestling fan at one time Astronaut as you may be aware of then I know what the cage actually implies and how relevant and dangerous it can be to the fight too - especially when that cage is made out of steel. Try getting your body thrown against that metal. That is a weapon in itself that one would like to use on their opponent. When it comes to wrestling, and entertainment then the more dangerous it is, the more entertaining. I'm only talking about wrestling here and the cage.
Yes, I know you never said it wasn't dangerous + risk free because the clips I've also seen then the injuries men have obtained aren't minor scratches. Broken bones is what I'm talking about. And to even think it's not like the professional cage fighting then I wonder why have they termed it cage fighting? Whether kids striked here or not, they should have woren head gears, but they didn't.
Perhaps the better question would have been 'What is nowadays?'
Fighting and aggression in itself doesn't lead towards discipline and not when it's breaking boundaries or rules established in any environment. Aggression has to be channelled - be it any means - but it has to be free of danger and exploitation too. The focus that is greatly enforced onto parents and teachers is getting the children to be safe guarded and at the same time to provide them discipline through all walks of life. It was more of a show than the sport - I mean one boy even cried and it had to be stopped after round 2. You think that child was a pro?
Here's the video -
Yes, of course. But to me it was more of a show than a sport.
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Post by isa on Sept 24, 2011 9:56:46 GMT -5
lol You do have a habit of wandering off and getting lost in the fields of irrelevance, Star. We are not talking about the WWE.
You’re not making much sense.
They termed it ‘cage fighting’ because it is cage fighting.
I presume you mean some sort of head protection, in which case I agree, although, seemingly, it isn't currently stipulated by law.
lol Poor. Face it - you have no idea how efficient the practice is at instilling discipline in those who attend, and you have no idea, in this regard, about the intentions of those who teach it. It was a silly comment.
I took pains, previously, to alert you to the differences between the professional pursuit and what was occurring in the video.
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Post by Spellbound454 on Sept 24, 2011 11:46:38 GMT -5
Why don't they go the whole hog and give them chainsaws.... "Two men enter... one man leaves"..........  |
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Post by starlight07 on Sept 24, 2011 11:54:49 GMT -5
I sometimes feel you are taking me out on some motorbike ride and I'm going in circles along with yourself, Astronaut. I'll try my best in answering your comments/questions now.
WWE is not entirely irrelevant here since the wrestling culture and the entertainment provided for children and adults first springs from there or that it takes most of the credit. It's a package on its own. As for having a habit of wandering off and getting lost in the fields of irrelevance, Astro, then admit it, it's kinda refreshing in its own way.
Okay to the main point/s.
You said -
So I asked -
You say -
I know it's a fight in a cage but that was not my point. If it's not at the professional level like you've said, then don't you think it's better to call it something else or for it to be made clear to the general public like myself what this sort of cage fighting with children really involves? The name usually gives it away. The woman in the video says the children were doing grappling - maybe it should have been called that?
Perhaps it should be. Protection comes first in any instance. I would have thought the boys' parents being serious in their childrens' health.
Maybe, you're right but then again neither does anyone else. How do I know what everyone involved intentions were?
Read this again -
How does this man say with 100% certainty that his son was not at harm? What guarantee was there? I'm I allowed to make an assumption here? Can't you see through this man's comments?
Yes, thank you but the child cried here...maybe he was not strong willed for the event or it wasn't for him? It was stopped after 10 minutes or so and though it's not explained as to why it can be that the children were woren out.
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Post by Spellbound454 on Sept 24, 2011 11:58:29 GMT -5
What I objected to
is an 8 year old boy, swaggering into a ring...getting cheered on by adults as if he was Mike Tyson.
Its a kudos he should never have... and I think the parents are bonkers to allow it.
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Post by isa on Sept 24, 2011 18:53:30 GMT -5
Yes, it’s the context I referred to - the atmosphere, the mindset, prevalent in that environment. It doesn’t foster the same respect or responsibility that accompanies other forms of youth martial art event.
Heh, no, Star, you ride yourself out there. I'm just standing here watching and occasionally yelling things like “Do a wheelie!”. Your concern for the children is admirable. Your arguments are messy.
Regards.
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Post by starlight07 on Sept 26, 2011 9:35:52 GMT -5
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Post by isa on Sept 26, 2011 10:26:06 GMT -5
Yes, he’s done very well there. I’ve read similar things elsewhere in the MA media this week too. Stupidity, on the part of the promoters, seems to be the general consensus.
Your point of not naming it cage-fighting was to distinguish the amateur youth from the professional adult - a necessity only you perceived and for a reason known only to yourself - that’s not what he is saying though.
Actually he’s saying that the cage is safer than using ropes in this kind of martial discipline, and that it also increases the commercial appeal of the sport. He goes on to say that terming it ‘cage-fighting’ is something promoters do to make it more appealing to the public, and ultimately, he thinks, this has a negative impact on the growth of the sport due to the uninformed notions that many people entertain about the cage. lol The former is exactly what I said to you, at which point you started talking about the use of cages in World Wrestling Entertainment (WWE) - a fictitious, daftly-scripted, spandex-laden comedy of ridiculousness that has nothing to do with the real world of mixed martial arts. Messy flutterby!
It is justified to question the environment in which that particular event occurred. Everything else is just nonsense.
Cheers for that article.
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Post by usamomma on Sept 26, 2011 11:09:41 GMT -5
I have read that often children get hurt by baseballs. I heard one kid got hit in the head with a baseball and suffered serious life-threatening injury. One man's son is in a coma after getting hit in the head with a baseballwww.topix.com/forum/sports/little-league/TE2O2LUNPI6TNONKUMany children get hurt playing basketball and football too. Many children have died playing such sports! In the United States, about 30 million children and teens participate in some form of organized sports, and about 3.5 million injuries occur each year. The most common injuries are sprains and strains. Brain injury is the leading cause of sports-related death in children. The majority of head injuries occur during bicycling, skateboarding, or skating incidents. Many injuries occur as a result of falls, being struck by an object, collisions and overexertion during unorganized or informal sports activities. About 60 percent of organized sports-related injuries occur during practice. About 20 percent of children and adolescents participating in sports activities are injured each year, and one in four injuries is considered serious. www.childrenshospital.org/az/Site1112/mainpageS1112P1.htmlPerhaps we should stop all sporting activities so children can do more time sitting on their ever-growing fatter arses and learning more subjects and taking more standardized tests? Sending them to school wrapped in bubble wrap could be helpful too. After all, what if they trip on a crack in the sidewalk? Better yet, send them all to school in wheelchairs so they do not risk walking injuries.. In all seriousness though, kids get injured playing sports. Just a part of life and of growing up. In regards to this "Cage Fighting" I do feel more protections needed such as helmets to be worn, groin protection and mouth guards too, just like in average martial arts tournaments such as Tae Kwon Do. When done properly, and under strict guidance and the following of guidelines most injuries can be prevented or less serious and being involved in sports of any kind is exercise, healthier than sitting in front of the computer or tele; and teaches discipline, self respect and respect of others, and how to work with others if in team sport. |
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Post by Spellbound454 on Sept 26, 2011 13:46:19 GMT -5
Hi Momma
There is nothing wrong with kids doing a bit of exercise and having some discipline for a sport they like.
Kids will get injured doing all sorts of activity and its hard to predict
However... these kids were being applauded walking into the cage at some seedy venue....with a voracity that best befits a dog fight.
Its no place for children and even if they were to engage in a martial arts tournament they wouldnt be subject to such scenes.
Its the whole "toddlers and tiaras" mentality where the adults live vicariously through their kids and fool themselves that its ok......it isnt.
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